In this episode of Roompact’s ResEdChat, host Jas Nettles is joined by Hayley a recovery program manager. Recovery programs on college campuses aren’t new but have definitely become more of trend that’s designed to support students recovering from substance use disorders (SUDs). These programs, often part of student affairs or wellness initiatives, provide resources such as peer support, counseling, sober living spaces, and recovery-friendly social events. They aim to create a supportive environment that enables students to maintain their recovery while pursuing academic and personal goals.
Guest: Hayley Thomas (she/her), Recovery Program Manager
Host: Jasmine Nettles
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About ResEdChat
Roompact’s ResEdChat podcast is a platform to showcase people doing great work and talk about hot topics in residence life and college student housing. If you have a topic idea for an episode, let us know!
Transcript:
Jasmine Nettles:
Hey, y’all. Welcome back to the Roompact ResEdChat Podcast. I’m one of your hosts, Jas Nettles. I use she/her pronouns. I’m the associate director for Residential Curriculum, Living Learning Communities, and Signature Events at Eastern Kentucky University.
I have a special guest with me today to get into a conversation about Sober Spaces in Higher Education: A New Path Forward for Student Wellness. This is something that sparked for me just in general conversation, but I will let my guest go ahead, and introduce herself.
Hayley Thomas:
Hi. Yes, hello, my name is Hayley Thomas. I am newly the Associate Assistant Director of Well-Being Initiatives at Baylor. I formally started as recovery program manager for the Beauchamp Addiction Recovery Center on campus, which is a collegiate recovery community that Baylor houses.
Jasmine Nettles:
Yeah. Hayley and I have been besties sisters since 2018 when we met for grad school at the University of Central Arkansas. I’m pretty sure you’re noticing a trend here, if you’ve been watching my other episodes. But like I said, in my conversations with Hay, and talking about what her job actually was, and being in Eastern Kentucky where the opioid or just the drug pandemic is starting to be more of a conversation, we talked a little bit about recovery programs on college campuses and what that looks like, because that was something that I had absolutely no idea about.
While they’re not new, it was definitely something new for me. Obviously, the intention behind a recovery program is to support students or students who are from families that are recovering from some type of substance abuse. Then these programs often are a part of a student affairs, student affairs division, or a wellness initiative, which I just think is very cool. It provides resources to students such as different kinds of faculty and staff support, counseling, sober living spaces, so residence hall space, and recover friendly social events. I’m very excited to talk to Hay a little bit about that.
First, Hayley, can you tell me about the recovery program at Baylor, just a little bit maybe the name, and just what the program was based around?
Hayley Thomas:
Yes, of course. We have the Beauchamp Addiction Recovery Center on campus through reality, that is the name of our recovery community. However, we personally are trying to shift that narrative because addiction actually does hold stigma with it. Students are not as encouraged to use the resources because of that. We’re walking through with the BARC. We go by the BARC. We really lean into the dog narrative, the name, and everything as well. We established, I don’t want to lie because I just had the number in head, but maybe five or seven years ago, the BARC was.
We came to fruition because Baylor was, and this was, again, before my time. I’m telling you history that I know of before my time. But there were Alcohol Anonymous meetings happening within the community. There was already a need taking place. The institution was seeking out a way to support students, and help support that need that they saw growing.
We were actually blessed by the Beauchamp family who did a donation. With the way they donated, we were able to establish the BARC. Now, we continue supporting the BARC through the donations they have. One thing that is a true fun fact for us is that we do have an endowment. Where other institutions may struggle establishing a recovery community, because a lot of times, what does come into play is a lot of networking, and need to fundraise to finance these. We are in a different position. I do recognize the privilege in that, but we have been very supported by the Beauchamp family who donated for us to get this started.
Now, later years down the road, we are coming back into a stronger formative year. Because before COVID, the center was actually really strong, had a community created, and was going really strongly. Then post-COVID, we had shift in roles, lots of little chaos just built off of what COVID caused. Now, we’re back in a space where we’ve established a strong community, more engagement from students, things of that nature. But that is how we’re established.
Our goal is there, to support students and what their experience looks like at Baylor, if they are navigating any kind of addiction. Whether that’s alcohol use, drug use, or my past supervisor, Jose Vallejo, who is an amazing individual, who actually is the director of the BARC, he would say anything that has any life controlling behaviors. It’s never just alcohol and drug use. Sometimes it’s gaming, it’s pornography, it’s using your phone too much or not even be able to set structure for yourself because you’re prioritizing other things. That’s something that we really lean into because the reality is everyone struggles with something. Drug use and alcohol use just have a harder stigma associated with it.
Jasmine Nettles:
Yeah. I love that the program isn’t just drug abuse. Because I know when I first was getting introduced to it, that’s all I thought it was, was drug or alcohol. Having the conversation to learn that it can encompass so many different things, I think is really dope. I know that you all have dedicated space for students to do events. With that or just whatever the component of that is, with the connection to housing or just students who live on campus, can you maybe share some things that you think are key elements to make a program like this, an office, or space like this successful?
Hayley Thomas:
Yeah. I think one thing too is we’ll be actually just a tenure review. We’re trying to revamp and capitalize on what we already have, and find our areas of improvement. Our department in general, which is the Department of Student Care and Well-being, which the BARC falls under, we actually should attend your review because we want to make it better. For us, the realization is we need a bigger space and a more centralized space to be more successful, more fruitful, and just supporting more students.
But the reality is, our location now does serve as well because we are attached to residence hall, it’s not a huge space. Oh, I regret not being in my office right now because I’ll show you all this space. But with that, we are attached to residence hall, and especially this year, we really intentionally planned, programmed, and partnered with the residence halls to garner engagement. Because reality is, not everybody needs our services, but everyone does need to know of our services. Because while everybody doesn’t need them, everybody knows someone who does.
That was really our goal in this season. I think the biggest piece is not siloing. As we know in higher ed, that is the death of the institution or that takes away the resources from students. You can’t fully benefit them, and support them unless we have these things built out, and that we are collaborating. I think that a big piece for us was it’s helpful being attached to a residence hall that supports what we’re doing, and the hall director team that supports our efforts.
I, again, loved our partners this past year especially. Again, because this is the year that I served in the role. But a big piece is you have to have investment from all players. The reality is the BARC work is a lot of hard work and good work, but it can’t just be my responsibility are Jose’s responsibility to support these students. It has to be everyone’s. I think when we’re working in this field, specifically student affairs, that is literally our purpose, is to come together to support students best way we can. It really is just buy-in from everyone.
Jasmine Nettles:
Yeah. Honestly, that’s a great segue into what my next question is going to be. Obviously, the stigma around any type of drug abuse, any type of substance, or any type of anything that is just not healthy or something that can translate into addiction, that’s obviously not something, especially post-COVID, that students do a really good job of asking for help for, or even just talking about whatever their experience has been with their families. Can you talk a little bit about maybe some of the ways your team used to or will still do, how do you do outreach to students that may not be necessarily seeking out the services but you know the students are there to get them to come to events or just visit the center?
Hayley Thomas:
Yeah. Something that we really work intentionally with, and two things that we do, there are nuances in this as well. All to say this, and I want to preface this before I speak any further, I don’t know everything. I’m not all consuming of knowledge. I will not always say the correct things when it comes to this work. Again, I’m still learning. But we are taking really intentional steps to make sure students know our resources by doing external programming, large scale programming to bring people in so they’re aware of us. Then smaller scale programming for the people that are actually a part of the program or that need our services.
Another piece of that to get people connected is we utilize our care team, and our conduct office. I do think there’s some nuance with the conduct piece because we have it where we have these wellness consultations that take place. If a student gets in trouble, or is cited for excess alcohol, they do have to come and check in or often, the judicial affairs will send them to check in with someone for wellness consultation to complete their … What’s the word?
Jasmine Nettles:
Like an intake or something?
Hayley Thomas:
Yeah, to complete their …
Jasmine Nettles:
Or an evaluation.
Hayley Thomas:
Yeah, I don’t want to say penalty, because that’s not the word I’m trying to use, but to complete their …
Jasmine Nettles:
Oh, their sanction.
Hayley Thomas:
Their sanction. Yes, girl, their sanction. That one has been a little more challenging in the sense that the students are not seeking out our support, and they’re really just trying to check a box. But our spirit and intention is that because they now have been connected to us, if they do need something or if they ever are in a space where they need support, they know that they can at fact come to us, and not in a space that just because they’re in trouble or something.
When it comes to care team, I think most institutions now have a care team. I will say, our care team is phenomenal. Honestly, I wish there were a thousand of them because the work they do is just top two work, but also really hard work. They have such case loads. But they do a really good job. I think a lot of the students that really embrace the BARC in their recovery journey are students who the care team have been contacted, and they connect us to the students.
If we have a student that is struggling, and maybe a professor notices that that student is struggling, they’ll put in a report, the care team will reach out, meet with the student, and then be like, “Hey, here are some resources that are going to be helpful.” If they could connect with them on something or if they talk about drug use, alcohol use, or gaming, anything that they’re struggling with when it comes to life controlling behaviors, they will connect them with us, then we will consult with them and meet with them.
Usually, the students are really willing and wanting to do that. That’s probably the biggest piece of how we get students to intentionally be there. If we notice the students having several violations or struggling with several things, we will be intentional about checking in with them, as someone reaches out. Something that we’ve also been super mindful of in this season is really partnering with Multicultural Affairs, Greek Life, just activities, like people who see students on the front end-
Jasmine Nettles:
On a regular basis?
Hayley Thomas:
… often, and can say, “Hey, I know this person may be struggling.” Sometimes they may tell us, and we’ll check in on them. But oftentimes, they’ll tell the student. The students will come to us, chat, and check in or just even just observe the space.
We’ll talk about stigma a little bit, I’m sure. But we do something to navigate that.
Jasmine Nettles:
Yeah. Honestly, that’s, like I said, my entire intrigue for the whole thing, even though I know that any type of life changing or life controlling behavior, it’s specific to the person, I was curious when they first started talking about it on our campus, what does that look like from an outreach standpoint? Especially because students would just rather not get the help, or we’ve just experienced such a high volume of students who prefer to just suffer in silence, even if it’s not them directly, like if it’s a family member or a sibling or something.
But I’m curious, because we’re friends on social media, so I see the stuff that you do. Do you all have traditional events or anything specific that you do that is large scale or small, from a programming standpoint that’s worked really well, and has kept the students engaged that you just enjoyed or maybe just your favorite one?
Hayley Thomas:
Yeah. There are probably a couple things that we do. I’ll chat all day. I’ll try to be mindful. But a big thing that we do is we do Recovery Week, which typically takes place in April. April, I think, 15th was the National Collegiate Recovery Day. We always program large scale on that day, but we take the whole week to celebrate recovery. Because reality is going on recovery journey is a huge deal. It’s not easy, especially when you think that a college student committing to recovery is so young.
Jasmine Nettles:
While they’re in school, yeah.
Hayley Thomas:
While they’re in school, and they’re so young. This commitment is usually a lifelong thing. Honestly, one thing that we’re really mindful of is, we don’t define recovery for student. Because the reality is, we have a plethora of students who are like, “I maybe …” Jose, former supervisor, Director of the BARC, again, great resource, he often says, “There can be students that come in there like, ‘I’m currently drinking 40 beers a day. I don’t want to drink 40 beers a day. I want to drink five beers a week or something,'” or shift it. Sometimes, recovery for someone is not abstinence. We can’t define that for a student, but we are there to help coach them on that path. I just want to approach that too.
But for Recovery Week, we do large scale programming. I think this past year was really, really fun. We did a lot of fun stuff. Our big thing is we did Boogie and Boyle where we just celebrated everyone’s journey, and those who were in recovery. We did a banner that was like, “Recovery is,” and all the students that came signed it. It’s not just students who are in recovery, but we called them recovery allies, people who are supporting people in recovery, or people who have family members that are in recovery. We all just celebrated, and was really high attendance, really good vibes. But also just a way to get the BARC out there. I know that that’s a resource that collegiate community exists.
Other than that, my past supervisor does really well. Our recovery chaplain who is a grad chaplain that works in BARC, Katie Macy, I did tell them I’d say their names because they really do great. They really do. But she … Lost my train of thought.
Oh, yeah. They do really good at implementing internal events that are going on. Just casual hangouts, and game nights for people who are actively in recovery because we want to make sure that they have community. The goal of a collegiate recovery situation should always be community because that is what is most needed for people who are navigating recovery. Because there’s a lot of loneliness in that. There’s a lot of shame in that. It’s a lot of times unwarranted. They just don’t have the support of people around them to know it’s okay to be navigating something.
Then something else that we’ve done recently that we were going to make a tradition is we have this day called Diadeloso for Baylor, Day of the Bear. Law students, they go out, have no classes on that day, but sometimes idle hands can get into trouble. We like to create an alternative option for students to engage in fun that doesn’t necessarily have alcohol and stuff involved that evening and night. Because usually, we do a lot of events during the day as staff and faculty for the students, as well as our student orgs. But that night, we cannot control what they’re going to do.
We’ve started doing this, where we have a movie night, Meet the BARC at Cinemark. Any student that wants to engage in sober fun, and have a good time with community still, we pay for a movie ticket, and we just have rented out a whole theater, and have a movie experience there. That was something that we did this year that was really effective and really fun.
There are several things. Next year, we’re hoping to try do a sober fest going into the end of September into October. Just because we all know that October into November is homecoming season on top of Halloween, and just a lot of partying that does take place in the normal college calendar. We like to do preventative information there as well.
Then the final thing that I say is probably the most effective, and intentional, is tabling. Being in spaces where students aren’t giving them the information is important. Our student workers do go out and table in the residence halls, table in the dining halls, and just let people know of our resources. Also, we do preventative education if we know some big events are coming up. But also alternative education for resources for otherwise.
Jasmine Nettles:
I love that. I think sometimes, especially I know in the pre-meeting that we had, there were a lot of players involved in it. From a programming standpoint, there really weren’t many on the group call other than housing who had that background. I know the conversations we had to have about reminding people like, “Yes, you want to do this because this is an issue.” But the community part of it, if you don’t include the programming and the social in the proposal, then it’s not going to be included after that. I love that that’s the primary or the nexus of that for BARC, or just at Baylor in general.
Leading into my next question, I think another reason why I was so intrigued by it, because Baylor is a private Christian university. I was very surprised that there are dedicated resources to something like that. Can you talk maybe about the stigma that’s on campus around BARC, whether it’s positive or negative, or just what the community of your students looks like when it comes to existing on Baylor’s campus, and being somebody who regularly attends or visits the BARC?
Hayley Thomas:
Absolutely. One thing I’ll say is I always explain to people, and you’re not alone. Even people on campus are always like, “We are surprised that we have a collegiate recovery community on campus.” It’s like as a private Christian institution or as a Christian institution in general, that should be what we’re doing. The work we’re doing is to support and help all of us, to love all of us, and to care for all of us. Why would we not have this resource? You know what I mean?
Jasmine Nettles:
Absolutely.
Hayley Thomas:
I feel like if we’re doing the Lord’s work, that’s a part of it, in my professional opinion. But there is a lot of stigma associated. There can be a lot of stigma associated with addiction recovery. Again, as I said before, everyone struggles with something, but the things that are highlighted like alcohol and drug use, and just certain things are elevated in a negative way are more frowned upon, and that’s the reality. But you can have just as big of an issue with being on your phone, shopping, or things like that, and you have less of a stigma associated with it.
Something that we do is we really do try to navigate that well by being intentional about our programming for everybody. That’s why we do that large scale program. Everybody see this as a space that they can come into.
We also make the BARC a very open space. Students might come hang out, study, and check in. They don’t have to be somewhat actively in recovery to come spend time in the BARC. We encourage that because we don’t want people to feel like if they go into the BARC, that they’re outing themselves as somebody in recovery.
Jasmine Nettles:
Nice.
Hayley Thomas:
That’s why those partnerships and collaborations are so important, because we will have faculty and staff from other areas just come by, drop in, just check in, and say, “Hey, I’m going to the BARC to check in with Hayley, Jose,” or whatever that looks like. That happens with our staff. Then it starts trickling down to our students who go like, “Hey, I’m just going to go check in, and see what Hayley’s up to, Jose’s up to, or Katie’s up.” It takes away the stigma associated with it. You’re not outing yourself as somebody in recovery, you’re just someone who’s going to see someone. You’re going to facilitate community.
I think that’s really important because, again, addiction is a big piece. Anyone that is establishing a collegiate recovery community, I feel like Jose would say this, my Supervisor Megan Becker would say this, that the goal would be, if you establish something, to make sure that you’re thinking about the language you’re using. Because for us, we are hoping to at some point change the name of the BARC from being the Beauchamp Addiction Recovery Center to still being the BARC, and still having the Beauchamp’s name in it, but we don’t want addiction in the title. Because it does have such a negative stigma.
We can’t control that narrative, but we can control the experience around that, and how people come in and out of our spaces, and feel supported in our spaces. But that is a big thing. The large scale programming, knowing we program for everyone, but then we do more intentional programming. I am a professional. More intentional programming for the students within the BARC that have community.
Another thing that we do that helps facilitate the community that we have is we do have group meetings. We have our one key meeting, which is basically Alcohol Anonymous. We have that later in the evening. Our offices is open from 8:00 to 7:00 PM. But 7:00 PM is a cut-off because we have meetings in that space that’s more anonymous so people don’t have to feel like they’re adding themselves.
But we also have NAMI, which is a mental health alliance group that needs one key. That’s the first one we have. Living Room, which is basically a space to talk through experiences with family or friends that are navigating addiction, and things of that nature. We have all those groups. They’re peer led. That probably is going to be the key piece.
When I think about all the work that we did at the BARC, it does not function without students supporting students. Me and you can talk all day to a student that needs support to we’re blue in the face, but they’re going to feel like, “You don’t know my plight. You don’t know my experience. You’re old. What are you doing?” Even though we know about that. But they don’t feel the same way. But when you have these peer-to-peer conversations, they feel way more supported and understood by someone who has that lived experience, and can walk alongside them.
All of the groups that we do outside of the BARC are peer led. They’re often my students navigating recovery themselves or students who are passionate about helping others through recovery. That’s probably the key piece to our success in our area.
Jasmine Nettles:
I love that. Peer led is crazy, I think. Because I don’t even think there was a consideration of that. Because I know in our conversations, it was all about the staff. You have to pay at X, Y and Z, while I’m sure the peer students still get some type of compensation, it never even occurred to me that a peer led session was an option or maybe something that other institutions have considered. That’s good for me to follow away, just in case. That’s something that can help with teacher.
I love it. My last formal question for you, do you have a success story or a student that stands out to you the most from your time when you worked at BARC, that you’d be willing to share with us before I wrap us up?
Hayley Thomas:
I’ll share a student. I won’t say their name, because I don’t know how can they feel about it. But I do have an assistant that I genuinely admire, and that developed a really great relationship with. I’m always proud of her. I honestly think that she is one of the faces of the BARC. She doesn’t have to be that. I tell her all the time. I was like, “You don’t have to be the face,” because in her journey, being the face of something, she has to consistently out herself as someone in recovery. I don’t think that’s always fair, but I’m always proud because she’s willing to do that to help someone else.
But she struggled as a student in her freshman year, I guess, navigate a couple of conduct issues within the residence halls for alcohol use, and things like that. I wasn’t a part of her full journey, but I got to hear her story, and then walk alongside her now. But she got in trouble a few times. Then she had, basically, I think, had to do a wellness consultation, which is what happens after you go through a conduct process. They’re like, “In order for you to be,” again, the wellness consultations that we discussed earlier, that aren’t always great and are frowned upon because it seems like a penalty.
But at one point, I believe she came to the BARC, did her little consultation, and was good on it. Then Jose, who’s really intentional and genuinely believes in giving people an opportunity to be successful, and to have community, offered her a job. Was like, “Do you want a job? Do you need a job?” At first, no interest. Then I think eventually, she found her way back, and she was like, “Yep, I want a job.”
Having the job, having that risk, and that’s the thing too, I would always say to faculty and staff too is like, “You’ve got to take chances on these students because you don’t know. You don’t know what their experience is going to be.” There will be students who make mistakes, mess up, and let you down, but at the end of the day, we’re here to help them figure it out, not the other way around.
But she ended up coming back to the BARC. Now, she’s doing all the things that need to be done. She’s currently doing peer support ally training. She leads one of the groups. She’s always advocating and talking to students. She helps and leads out in presentations, outreach, learning how to do Narcan training, which is something that our office also does, leads out on doing that, and has really just been a shining star. Now, they’re wanting her to be a mentor for the peer ally program that she’s currently working in and working on.
It’s good to see someone get so invested in their journey, that they become fully just engrossed in it. Even at times, I had to be like, “My girl …”
Jasmine Nettles:
Coffee breaks.
Hayley Thomas:
“Your whole life doesn’t have to be this unless you want to be it.” But she just feels so passionate about helping people with the experience that she’s had. Yeah, she’s a phenomenal student. I love that girl. She definitely is, I think, one of the shining examples.
Jasmine Nettles:
Yeah. Honestly, even what you said though, what has that not been for us other than student affairs? That’s exactly what student affairs is for. I love that that is literally the tradition. It doesn’t matter what the functional area is, you really never know how you’re going to connect to a student. Sometimes, I know some of my favorite students are students I’ve met in conduct situations or crisis situations, and still talk to them to this day or just any type of relationship I have with them.
But something that I want to make sure I ask before I do a wrap up, if there was any piece of advice for someone looking to do this kind of work, what would you tell them?
Hayley Thomas:
Yeah, I would say, get in the research. The reality is recovery world is a journey. I think there’s a lot of information, and a lot of data out there. There’s even the argument of, “Is it a disease? Is addiction a disease?” There’s so much nuance in between it, but I think the reality is if you’re interested in recovery work, knowing, and walking along students in their journey, and have that desire, one, you’re going to have to humble yourself because the reality is, if you’re not someone who’s not good recovery yourself-
Jasmine Nettles:
You don’t know, yeah.
Hayley Thomas:
… you don’t know their struggle, and you can’t say that you do. It comes from a plethora of areas. But also, just be mindful that their journey is going to have dips. We always say recovery is not linear. You cannot expect that from a student. But walking alongside them, and being with them in the lows is going to be very important.
I would attach myself to some professional organizations, which I know we talked about earlier. I don’t want to say the name wrong, but [inaudible 00:28:29] all those things are going to be really good resources. If you haven’t been to NASPA Strategies, I’m going to plug NASPA real quick. Wonderful conference. I went first and last year. There’s so much information about recovery communities. There’s so much information about wellness and well-being. There’s so many people who are willing to pour into that. There’s so much about AOD in general, alcohol and drug use. I just think that’s a great place to get started if you have interest.
Then also, if you’re building a community out, lean into your students and your peer support systems. Because the students champion each other. If we can get them to do that, then it’s going to be successful. But that would probably be the biggest pieces. Don’t lose the focus is community. It really is.
Jasmine Nettles:
Yeah. As someone who’s never experienced that, but has a experience or connection tied to my family with addiction, I don’t think we consider the community part. Because the knee-jerk reaction to someone who struggles with addiction, and maybe doesn’t want to go into recovery and stuff like that is to abandon them. I think that’s just culturally, and just socially, in general. But I love that that is the nexus, like I said earlier.
Hay, thank you. Of course, always. It’s a good time to chat. I want to end this with just a little bit of information, and just some hotline information for y’all. According to the 2023 United States National Survey on Drug Use and Health, it’s NSDUH, 48.5 million or 16.7% of Americans aged 12 and older battled with some sort of substance use disorder in the past year. That’s a high number.
I encourage my people who listen to this podcast or just who do the student affairs work to be aware of those stats in your community. It’s not your job to take it on and save the world, but it is your job to know. If you know someone or if you yourself are struggling with any type of abuse or life controlling behavior, please do not hesitate to call 988, which is the crisis hotline for assistance. Thank y’all so much for joining me on another episode of the Roompact ResEdChat Podcast. I’ll see y’all next time. Bye.
